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RedCafe.net - Thu Nov 9 11:03 AM
Tweet — Twitter API (@user) date First time in the football forum since the loss. It's very alarming the gap that has opened up in a short space of time. During the summer, I kept harping us about us not doing anywhere enough during the transfer window, in part because I think we simply couldn't...
RedCafe.net - Thu Nov 9 10:20 AM
Winger who we've apparently signed from SL Benfica. Saw him at the Marveld Tournament 2 years ago and was probably the best player there which had some amazing players. Still regarded as one of the best prospects in Europe and I think Madrid bid around 8 million for him in the summer. http://www....
RedCafe.net - Thu Nov 9 7:46 AM
cal? VS green_smiley TACTIC Cal? ​ Formation : 4-2-3-1 Defensive Line : Moderate-high We'll be looking to dominate the game, the opposition has a number of decent DMs but no real creator to provide chances for the strikers. One of the best keeper in Van der Sar , behind 2 modern greats in Dominoe...
RedCafe.net - Wed Nov 8 11:28 PM
Since roughly around 2010 and up until now, we've been in what many consider The Golden Age of TV . I am of course of these people. With bigger budgets and better writing, it's become hard to deny this. However, I've recently come to realize that even if we are in the so-called golden age, there...
RedCafe.net - Wed Nov 8 8:02 PM
Thought it might be worth making a new thread, as a lot of what is happening now can't be put in the General Election thread. So it seems like the Tories are all backing Theresa (for the moment): Tweet — Twitter API (@user) date Tweet — Twitter API (@user) date Meanwhile Labour can't decide wheth...
RedCafe.net - Wed Nov 8 5:26 PM
idmanager VS Lord SInister TACTICS ​ idmanager: Formation : 4-4-2, defend deep and hit hard on the counter Defense : Dietz , the Euro 1980 winning captain of Germany, is a great option here to face Messi. He played as a full back in the first phase of his career and as CB in the latter Dominoes d...
RedCafe.net - Wed Nov 8 4:47 PM
What is it? It's an internet radio station which concentrates on 1970s style soft rock and West Coast Music featuring the likes of CSN, Steely Dan, Todd Rundgren, 10cc, and Joni Mitchell to name but a few and describes itself as "yacht friendly." Now I grew up listening to glamrock, graduating to...
RedCafe.net - Wed Nov 8 4:22 PM
I have no idea why Europe won't do anything about this http://www.foxnews.com/science/2017 s-whale-slaughter-in-faroe-islands-hunts.html
RedCafe.net - Wed Nov 8 4:01 PM
Join this week's host Nik @Rood , Craig @Schmiznurf and Ed @That'sHernandez as they discuss yet another bad result away to Chelsea and the penalty shennanigans against Benfica. Then a quick preview of the visit of the Toon Army plus the international break, postmen, biscuits, grown men crying and...
RedCafe.net - Wed Nov 8 3:31 PM
http://www.bbc.com/news/technology-41913740 Facebook 'remembers' nude images to combat revenge porn Facebook is testing a system that allows users to message themselves their nude photos in an effort to combat so-called revenge porn. It will store a "fingerprint" of images to prevent any copies o...
RedCafe.net - Wed Nov 8 1:53 PM
04/05 05/06 06/07 07/08 08/09 09/10 10/11 11/12 12/13 13/14 14/15 15/16 16/17 17/18 Manchester United £55, 130, 000 £28, 620, 000 £24, 480, 000 £93, 150, 000 £40, 730, 000 £24, 660, 000 £26, 370, 000 £56, 070, 000 £68, 810, 000 £69, 420, 000 £175, 820, 000 £140, 400, 000 £166, 500, 000 £147, 960,...
RedCafe.net - Wed Nov 8 1:44 PM
The Robins announced prices for the fixture last night and it is has been branded as a 'gold category' game which means away fans will be priced at £33 for an adult. City chief executive Mark Ashton said: “From the outset, we wanted to ensure as many of our loyal supporters as possible get the ch...
RedCafe.net - Wed Nov 8 11:15 AM
Anyone know why I can't see them? I imagine it is a setting on Chrome but not sure what it is as flash is enabled.
RedCafe.net - Wed Nov 8 2:50 AM
The white socks in European matches. Why is that? It's always bugged me. Those socks should only be used if they clash with the opposition's socks.
RedCafe.net - Wed Nov 8 1:13 AM
https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=10159339680705136 So what do we think of this ? I personally think he hits the nail on the head with most of the things he says, but at the same time sums up the hysteria at United amongst the fans even though we're second and getting pretty decent results. Th...
RedCafe.net - Tue Nov 7 9:49 PM
Marouane Fellaini filed a suit against New Balance claiming their shoes injured his feet. Fellaini says the boots he wore as part of an endorsement deal caused him "loss of enjoyment, inconvenience and impact on performance" and is asking for £2.1 million. Fellaini signed an endorsement deal with...
RedCafe.net - Tue Nov 7 7:20 PM
Skizzo VS Pat_Mustard TACTICS ​ Skizzo : ​ Formation - 4-3-3 Style - Deep defending, quick counters and transitions The team Gigi Buffon jumps into the goal here, and will look to marshall a solid Dominoes draft: R1 - Skizzo vs Pat_mustard
RedCafe.net - Tue Nov 7 4:39 PM
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football _the_day&ns_source=facebook&ns_linkname=sport Beeb reporting that jose needs to sell before buying. Shaw is the obvious one, but who else? Carrick? Mata? Herrera? Blind? Feels like Fellaini has earned his place, but i could see Mata and Herrera leaving due to r...
RedCafe.net - Tue Nov 7 3:47 PM
Rashford Lukaku Griezmann Perisic--Pogba--Matic-Valencia Then a three at the back + De Gea. Swap Martial in for Rashford if you like. I think Jose signed Lindelof to play in a back a 3. I think this is what Mourinho wanted. There is so much power, pace and attacking threat in there. I wonder if h...
RedCafe.net - Tue Nov 7 2:41 PM
Everton are prepared to launch an ambitious bid to lure Diego Simeone to Goodison Park - but Sam Allardyce remains the favourite for the vacant manager's job. The Toffees remain on the lookout for Ronald Koeman's successor with David Unsworth having taken charge of the last four matches. Sunday's...
RedCafe.net - Tue Nov 7 2:03 PM
This is something I have noticed a lot recently. I remember back in the days of Ronaldo R9 where we would see him and other top strikers score goals with the toe poke as opposed to now we see the majority of one on one shots for e.g are attempted with the inside of the boot to slot it past...
RedCafe.net - Tue Nov 7 1:23 PM
I was listening to a football podcast the other day and the subject of women mangers in the men’s game briefly came up. They brought up a few examples of this in France and in Britain in the lower leagues, but it had me thinking about the Premier League in particular. Can you see this happening s...
RedCafe.net - Tue Nov 7 9:04 AM
Thought I'd run a draft experiment. It's similar to this one currently run by spontaneous, but with drafted players instead of a manager who decides who to buy. Will obviously not get in the way of @spontaneus1 ' experiment, but it will probably take a long time to draft all 25 players so it's pr...
RedCafe.net - Tue Nov 7 8:59 AM
Forgive me if I’ve missed an open thread on him already in this section. I did search but found nothing. Anyway, I believe we should take a minute to reflect on poor Little Pea who, for the second time in his career, will be managed by Moyes. Alas, luck does not always favour the nice people.
RedCafe.net - Tue Nov 7 8:46 AM
Tweet — Twitter API (@user) date West Ham fan poll: http://www.kumb.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=170009&st=0&sk=t&sd=a
RedCafe.net - Tue Nov 7 5:16 AM
I was thinking of this while watching Spurs-Madrid, but the last week and Mkhi's continued struggles as a 10 and the nature of the Morata goal has only convinced me of this further: 1. The 3 at the back has kept Spurs, Liverpool and Chelsea to one goal in 270 minutes and that goal was conceded be...
RedCafe.net - Mon Nov 6 11:23 PM
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/fo N-SAMUEL-Thierry-Henry-doesn-t-make-five.html Ok I can agree with four of the names there. But the buffoon has Kante as third. Really? Ahead of Henry, Vieira and 100s of other great foreign players.
RedCafe.net - Mon Nov 6 10:56 PM
A few reports that Roman invited Jose to dinner after the game, e.g.: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/fo Mourinho-invited-dinner-Roman-Abramovich.html Anyone know if this actually happened? Surely quite odd (if it did).
RedCafe.net - Mon Nov 6 6:26 PM
The white socks in European matches. Why is that? It's always bugged me. Those socks should only be used if they clash with the opposition's socks.
RedCafe.net - Mon Nov 6 3:43 PM
The Soccer Manager Red Cafe League ​ If you want to join send me (Damien) a PM with your team and username ​ To join just pick a team in this topic and then search in Free online football manager game - Soccer Manager for world id 101474 and apply to that team. The rules are very simple: 1) there...
RedCafe.net - Mon Nov 6 3:34 PM
Former Manchester United owner and chairman, Martin Edwards joins Stephen Howson to discuss how Sir Alex Ferguson was recruited, why Batistuta wasn't signed, who we let go too soon, and why the Premier League was formed. Well worth your time on a cold November evening.
RedCafe.net - Mon Nov 6 3:17 PM
http://www.bbc.com/sport/football/41885250
RedCafe.net - Mon Nov 6 2:30 PM
The Soccer Manager Red Cafe League ​ If you want to join send me (Damien) a PM with your team and username ​ To join just pick a team in this topic and then search in Free online football manager game - Soccer Manager for world id 101474 and apply to that team. The rules are very simple: 1) there...
RedCafe.net - Mon Nov 6 12:20 PM
https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/worl aged-25/ar-AAutVL7?li=AAmiR2Z&ocid=spartandhp According to his wiki page he suffered a heart attack. Rest in peace.
RedCafe.net - Mon Nov 6 11:31 AM
No real surprise there, been coming for a while. Against Liverpool the other night he looked very downcast and almost resigned to his impending fate. http://www.bbc.com/sport/football/41702779
RedCafe.net - Mon Nov 6 9:59 AM
Seeing comments all over that 'once Pogba is back' everything will change for us. This may or may not be true, but the amount of pressure being heaped on one player is immense. Some will say that for the money and profile he has, this should be so, but it seems like in his absence, he has been el...
RedCafe.net - Mon Nov 6 5:40 AM
"I'll never forget what Sir Matt said to us one day when he pointed across to Trafford Park, which at the time was the largest industrial estate in Europe, " he said, his voice cracking with emotion. "He told us: 'The people over there work hard all week long and it is your job to go out on the f...
RedCafe.net - Mon Nov 6 4:58 AM
If we get a free kick in a shooting position, I feel confident we have the quality to make a decent chance. However, those same players taking free kicks or corners we might as well just give the ball to the opposition. We either seem to float it high to the back post but often it goes too far, o...
RedCafe.net - Mon Nov 6 4:06 AM
"I'll never forget what Sir Matt said to us one day when he pointed across to Trafford Park, which at the time was the largest industrial estate in Europe, " he said, his voice cracking with emotion. "He told us: 'The people over there work hard all week long and it is your job to go out on the f...
RedCafe.net - Mon Nov 6 3:44 AM
I've been thinking about this here and there based on many comments on this site from members that say they don't care how we play, they just want to win. Here are my thoughts: 1. Attractive football gives you joy just watching. If we play attractive football most of the time, say 60% of our matc...
RedCafe.net - Mon Nov 6 1:11 AM
Hands on hearts. How many of our players are truly good enough to form an 11 capable of firstly winning the Premier League, and secondly the Champions League? Because this is the criteria our players should ultimately be measured against. De Gea Bailly Matic Pogba In my opinion these are the only...
RedCafe.net - Mon Nov 6 12:21 AM
There is a lot of negativity going around here. It is understandable as we are all disappointed about the defeat today and also the current form since the last international break. I have been very negative as well particularly frustrated with our attacking football since we have not created much...
RedCafe.net - Sun Nov 5 8:23 PM
We're second in the league. Virtually through to the knockout stages of the Champions League and still in the League Cup. This without our best players (Pogba and Zlatan). City in such fine form is also causing our hearts and minds to not think rationally. Sir Alex's teams hardly won at Liverpool...
RedCafe.net - Sun Nov 5 7:53 PM
We're second in the league. Virtually through to the knockout stages of the Champions League and still in the League Cup. This without our best players (Pogba and Zlatan). City in such fine form is also causing our hearts and minds to not think rationally. Sir Alex's teams hardly won at Liverpool...
RedCafe.net - Sun Nov 5 7:51 PM
We were reduced to long balls against Chelsea earlier today, we have not a single playmaker other than Pogba (no Mkhitaryan doesn't count, he's crap) to break down a capable defense. Who is out there on the market that would fit into the team? I don't personally care whether it's a creative centr...
RedCafe.net - Sun Nov 5 7:45 PM
Far too often when we pass the ball back to the centre backs, they take absolutely ages to get the ball forward. They either pass it square back and forth a few times, then when pressed either pass back to de Gea or give it to a fullback/wingback who are already under pressure. I notice that they...
RedCafe.net - Sun Nov 5 7:30 PM
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RedCafe.net - Sun Nov 5 6:55 PM
We are lacking genuine quality in the ball in terms or creativity and passing. Should we strengthen in January? Or we should rely on mkh / mata / ibra to step up?
RedCafe.net - Sun Nov 5 6:55 PM
Stop it. You're making us look bad. The last month has been poor for us. That's fair enough to think and reflect on. But the amount of posts that are calling for his head or saying Mourinho is a "dinosaur" is ridiculous. We are still second in the league. We've qualified a tricky CL group. We don...
RedCafe.net - Sun Nov 5 6:55 PM
Obviously this will be called reactionary, but for too long we've been years behind in our thinking and approach. From employing Moyes because of tradition, to our lack of any kind of footballing minds behind signings - be that a DoF or anyone else, to the awful, woeful, dire football we've been...
RedCafe.net - Sun Nov 5 6:54 PM
Every other team gets a fresh thread for the upcoming season. Here's one for the Champions. Squad at the end of last season: GKs - Courtois, Eduardo Defs -Alonso, Zouma, Ake, Azpilicueta, Cahill, Luiz, Aina, Alonso, Moses, Kenedy Mids- Chalobah, Kante, Fabregas, Loftus-Cheek, Matic Fwds -Hazard,...
RedCafe.net - Sun Nov 5 6:37 PM
Go
RedCafe.net - Sun Nov 5 6:35 PM
We have individual assessments, Mourinho assessments, thinks its about time we had a collective one for the 11-14 who featured on match days. Didnt show up against Huddersfield and were pathetic again today. Whos to blame for their inability to pass to one another? Dont see how Pogba can make dif...
RedCafe.net - Sun Nov 5 6:35 PM
Let the discussion begin
RedCafe.net - Sun Nov 5 6:34 PM
Question, how many times have we managed to come back from behind and win a game the past 2 season? Feels like I can't recall any such but I'm sure there might be some. Everytime we concede first I already expect a loss regardless of the opponent caliber. Normally conceding against lower oppositi...
RedCafe.net - Sun Nov 5 6:33 PM
Big stuff in this including info about the Queen's private estate and the US commerce secretary Wilbur Ross. Tweet — Twitter API (@user) date
RedCafe.net - Sun Nov 5 6:03 PM
Damien said: ↑ Q: I want to post an article from a newspaper's website. Can I copy and paste the text on RedCafe? A: No. These days a lot of sites have soft or hard paywalls and Niall has frequently received e-mails from these sites threatening legal action because of posters pasting articles fro...
RedCafe.net - Sun Nov 5 5:19 PM
I find the most worrying thing under Jose is our lack of genuine quality. Pretty much all of those small things that the best players do - weight of pass, first touch, making the right decision - none of our team are doing these things anymore. It's just not sharp enough. I'm not convinced it can...
RedCafe.net - Sun Nov 5 3:54 PM
Former FIFA umpire, Schalke born and raised, Helmut Krug and current supervisor of the VAR system has come under scrutiny for potentially impacting the decisions of the video referee in the Schalke/Wolfsburg game for handing Schalke a very soft penalty and then denying Wolfsburg a clear cut handb...
RedCafe.net - Sun Nov 5 3:45 PM
Here we go Tweet — Twitter API (@user) date Tweet — Twitter API (@user) date
RedCafe.net - Sun Nov 5 2:19 PM
Cech Van Aaanholt- Ake - Zouma - Bertrand Matic - KDB Salah - Mata - Atsu Lukaku​ Subs: Begovic, Abrahams, Sturridge, Chalobah, Johnson, Loftus-Cheek Not a shabby team really. Am I missing anybody? Maybe more to the point, how many of those players would be useful to them now?
RedCafe.net - Sun Nov 5 2:04 PM
Tweet — Twitter API (@user) date A day earlier than usual because Jose has a tax fraud case tomorrow.
RedCafe.net - Sun Nov 5 1:35 PM
What do people make of his start in the PL? I ask the question as many of us wanted him at United. I think he has been average or below. He seems to make alot of rash tackles in most games I watch and today v Palace for example, he gave the ball away twice which firstly led to a...
RedCafe.net - Sun Nov 5 1:15 PM
He has been one of City's best buys in the past years. Reliable, relatively injury-free, does his job, and just an allround good CM with both defensive/offensive qualities.
RedCafe.net - Sun Nov 5 11:41 AM
Been seeing a lot of things on social media putting Stones in the best centre backs of the league. There was a post from a bookies putting him in the best centre backs of United, City, Chelsea, Arsenal as they all play today. He is so over hyped because he is English and ‘good on the ball’. If Ci...
RedCafe.net - Sun Nov 5 10:42 AM
Since it's official, I thought I'd create a new thread. Tweet — Twitter API (@user) date His first game will be against Guardiola's City. His first home game will be the North East Derby. His games against Everton will be September 12th (home) and February 25th (away) His games against United wil...
RedCafe.net - Sun Nov 5 10:10 AM
Never seem to fulfill his potential but actually been at the club for eight years
RedCafe.net - Sun Nov 5 9:49 AM
At Clayton Wood Kick off at 11am BST Live on MUTV
RedCafe.net - Sun Nov 5 8:44 AM
Im calling it early that the 2018 Champions League winner will come from 1 of these 4 teams. a) PSG b) Man City c) Spurs d) Manchester United Get on Betfair now you won't be sorry
RedCafe.net - Sun Nov 5 1:47 AM
Move confirmed. I still think Madrid are a better team in Europe. One year loan deal with obligation to buy.
RedCafe.net - Sat Nov 4 10:49 PM
Tweet — Twitter API (@user) date Tweet — Twitter API (@user) date Mourinho once again took credit for Real Madrid's recent successes "I would have liked to arrive at Real Madrid at the moment I left it, " Mourinho told Sport & Style. "I would like to land at Manchester United just when I decide t...
RedCafe.net - Sat Nov 4 10:08 PM
Hello. My name is Joe Mourinho and I am a football manager. I’ve been called many things over the years. Charismatic, special, arrogant, sexy, defensive, disrespectful, cheque book manager, Jose. Yeah I know, that last one really stings. In all honesty though I am pretty special. I’ve won everyth...
RedCafe.net - Sat Nov 4 9:10 PM
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RedCafe.net - Sat Nov 4 8:13 PM
Tweet — Twitter API (@user) date Tweet — Twitter API (@user) date
RedCafe.net - Sat Nov 4 7:37 PM
Poor lad Tweet — Twitter API (@user) date
RedCafe.net - Sat Nov 4 5:59 PM
What do people make of them? I think they're awesome especially the football and the soundwave ones. Great to also hear the old Fourscore music again.
RedCafe.net - Sat Nov 4 5:58 PM
Move confirmed. I still think Madrid are a better team in Europe. One year loan deal with obligation to buy.
RedCafe.net - Sat Nov 4 8:45 AM
Tweet — Twitter API (@user) date Tweet — Twitter API (@user) date Jose and Mkhi imo.
RedCafe.net - Sat Nov 4 8:30 AM
Followed by the next international break! Fixtures: League Table: Hope "Super Sunday" lives up to its hype.
RedCafe.net - Sat Nov 4 6:42 AM
Im calling it early that the 2018 Champions League winner will come from 1 of these 4 teams. a) PSG b) Man City c) Spurs d) Manchester United Get on Betfair now you won't be sorry
RedCafe.net - Sat Nov 4 6:14 AM
At Leigh Sports Village Kick off at 2pm GMT Telecast on MUTV from 5pm.
RedCafe.net - Sat Nov 4 4:36 AM
ho is your player of the month for October? Fixtures: Liverpool 0-0 ManUtd Benfica 0-1 ManUtd Huddersfield 2-1 ManUtd Swansea 0-2 ManUtd ManUtd 1-0 Spurs ManUtd 2-0 Benfica RedCafe Ratings for the matches Player stats Goals+Assists: Chances Created: ManUtd player of the month - October
RedCafe.net - Fri Nov 3 7:49 PM
http://www.skysports.com/football/news/31969/11111698/when-henry-met-lukaku Lukaku genuinely comes across as such an intelligent player and very much team first. Good stuff in there about Rashford and his mentality and leadership already.
RedCafe.net - Fri Nov 3 7:44 PM
To get us all in a good mood for our match this weekend; what are your favourite United goals against Chelsea? I originally planned a 'favourite United goals at the Bridge' but that meant I couldn't include my actual favourites (the first being what got me looking on YouTube) Forlan in 2003 (sadl...
RedCafe.net - Fri Nov 3 7:42 PM
Just seen this online New expansion "Battle for Azeroth" announced. Say what you will about Blizzard, they make a decent cinematic Blizzard finally caving in a having a vanilla option. I'm more interested in this than the expansion! Might have to re-sub!
RedCafe.net - Fri Nov 3 5:32 PM
from the BBC Archives, pretty good and you could substitute the Clough parts for Mourinho Tweet — Twitter API (@user) date
RedCafe.net - Fri Nov 3 5:03 PM
I just came across this on the BBC about his injury - http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/41857095 Arsenal's Santi Cazorla says doctors told him he should be "satisfied" just to walk again after he contracted gangrene following an operation. The 32-year-old Spain international last played in Octo...
RedCafe.net - Fri Nov 3 4:19 PM
I just came across this on the BBC about his injury - http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/41857095 Arsenal's Santi Cazorla says doctors told him he should be "satisfied" just to walk again after he contracted gangrene following an operation. The 32-year-old Spain international last played in Octo...
RedCafe.net - Fri Nov 3 3:21 PM
Can a passing mod please make this a yes/no poll? It's a simple question but would be great to get a feel for the consensus on here before the game kicks off. My stance is the same as it is every season. League winning form involves beating teams like Chelsea at home and drawing with them at thei...
RedCafe.net - Fri Nov 3 3:09 PM
Can a passing mod please make this a yes/no poll? It's a simple question but would be great to get a feel for the consensus on here before the game kicks off. My stance is the same as it is every season. League winning form involves beating teams like Chelsea at home and drawing with them at thei...
RedCafe.net - Fri Nov 3 2:34 PM
Damien said: ↑ Q: I want to post an article from a newspaper's website. Can I copy and paste the text on RedCafe? A: No. These days a lot of sites have soft or hard paywalls and Niall has frequently received e-mails from these sites threatening legal action because of posters pasting articles fro...
RedCafe.net - Fri Nov 3 1:39 PM
Let's hit this huge game with a positive caf attitude. Hows this for a mood setter, 20 months ago we lost at home to Southampton for our 12th league loss at old Trafford in two and half years As of today we have the clubs longest all time unbeaten record at old Trafford and haven't conceded from...
RedCafe.net - Fri Nov 3 9:31 AM
Damien said: ↑ Q: I want to post an article from a newspaper's website. Can I copy and paste the text on RedCafe? A: No. These days a lot of sites have soft or hard paywalls and Niall has frequently received e-mails from these sites threatening legal action because of posters pasting articles fro...
RedCafe.net - Fri Nov 3 8:56 AM
Manchester United manager Jose Mourinho has admitted he was surprised when he received a call from Nemanja Matic's agent offering him the chance to buy the player during the summer transfer window. Matic has been one of United's standout players since joining from Chelsea for £40m in July. The mi...
RedCafe.net - Fri Nov 3 5:47 AM
After seeing our Paddy doing a Cantona with a slight twist against his own supporters, You could not make that up could you. His own supporters were insulting him, I'm confused. Our own fans booing the likes of Lukaku and the manager, whats going on???? Is this a new trend or all the teams starti...
RedCafe.net - Fri Nov 3 3:48 AM
My dad has been an avid fan of The Jam since he was a kid & they started out. They are, to this day, his favourite band of all time, and he's been collecting 7" singles & rarities by them for north of 30 years (a collection that he plans on leaving to me, as I'm the one most interested...